Permission to Kick Ass

37: Sandi Marlisa

Episode Summary

Have you ever felt like you had to dial down your awesomeness? My guest today, Sandi MarLisa, says fudge that with absolutely no apologies. But she didn’t always have that attitude. Listen for her ass-kicking advice on how to move out of your own way and start letting your talent shine!

Episode Notes

If you’re a creative, you can’t be good at business and make a living. Sandi’s waving a big red BS flag on that crap. After losing her magic in the drudgery of everyday life, she rediscovered her passions and found success on her own terms – as a writer and full-time musician. Sandi’s proof that every problem is figure-outable. If she can do it, so can you. 

Can’t-Miss Moments From This Episode:

This one is jam-packed full of advice. Don’t miss out - listen now!

Sandi’s Bio:

Sandi considers herself a modern-day renaissance person. As a writer and musician, she also helps fellow creatives come into their own magic. You can usually find her wandering Downtown Lynn Haven, Florida and performing in various venues in the south east.

Resources and links mentioned:

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Episode Transcription

Angie Colee (00:02):

Welcome to Permission to Kick Ass. A podcast about leaving self-doubt in the dust, punching fear in the face and taking bold action toward your biggest dreams. I'm Angie Colee, and let's get to it. Hey and welcome back to Permission to Kick Ass. Today with me is my new friend, Sandi MarLisa. Say hi, Sandi.

Sandi MarLisa (00:25):

Hello everyone.

Angie Colee (00:27):

I love that. I'm so sad. They're not going to see the video cause that like that little shoulder action that you had go in there. That's really awesome. Um, Sandi is a singer, songwriter, writer of a book. I know that you've got a fantastic book out there called "To All Who Wander." Um, you post inspirational stuff on Facebook, like every damn day. And I just, I feel like I'm a broken, I say that because I'm a broken record. Cause I love everything you post, but I really do. I love everything you post. So, um, I'm so glad to have you on the show. And I really actually wanted to talk about that because I know I struggle with being somebody with a couple of different creative talents. Um, and almost to the point where I felt insecure about it. I don't know if you've ever shared anything like that, but like I'm a writer, I'm a singer. I can draw. I'm decent at painting. I'm learning to get better, but like there's a bunch of different things that are in my wheelhouse. And sometimes I almost feel guilty about having so many talents.

Sandi MarLisa (01:24):

Like being really good. No, absolutely. Like that is a legitimate fear. That's been a legitimate fear since my childhood is being so good at multiple things. And now like I'm 30 and I don't give a fuck anymore. I don't. I really, really don't like, I'm sorry, I'm sorry that I'm great. You know, what, what are you supposed to say to that at that point? You know, and you know, people think that sounds really arrogant sometimes, but like my big thing was defining what confidence and arrogance is to me. And arrogance is talking a big game, you can't back it up. And confidence is you've already won the damn game. You're just existing as the victor, you know, and that's kind of where I'm at now. And so like, I just don't apologize for it anymore. And honestly it makes other people uncomfortable when you apologize for being good. You know, it really does. Like I, I recognized that like moving through life, how uncomfortable I made other people feel by playing small and now that I'm starting to, and I'm not perfect at it, but I'm starting to inhabit the fullness of who I am as a person. It's amazing how much more confident I make other people feel to be in my presence because I'm not asking them to apologize for it either.

Angie Colee (02:48):

That's one of my favorite, you know, like loosely paraphrasing, one of my favorite quotes from Marianne Williamson about shining your light gives people permission to shine theirs as well. And I think that's so important because there are people out there that are watching whether you know it or not, when you, when you put yourself out in the public arena, when you create something and you put it in the other half of creation is not just keeping it all to yourself and waiting until you die. And then it gets published and people love it, but like, sure, while you're alive, while you can make a difference in people's lives and you can see the product of your work. People are watching that. And if you kind of backtrack, like you were talking about where it's like, you've created all this amazing stuff, you've clearly put a time, a ton of time and effort and even like emotion for a lot of us into creating this thing. And then somebody comes and tells you it's good. And you're like, "No, no I don't know." Yeah, yeah. A little bit of the magic dies.

Sandi MarLisa (03:41):

Yes. It makes people feel extremely uncomfortable when you start apologizing for it. And that's kind of like, cause I'm a person that wants to make people feel good and I'm like, that's, you know, I want to make people feel like they can be powerful. And when I'm playing small, that does nothing, nothing except make people feel small. And so that's a lot of work though on an, you know, in, in your inner man to call that out and be like, okay, you have to own your greatness because if you don't no one around you is going to do it either. And that's, that's a lot. I had to work on that a lot. That's a lot of loving yourself and learning how to.

Angie Colee (04:26):

Yeah, for sure. I think, especially in American culture here, we have that. I don't know this idea that if you follow all the steps and you keep your head down, you work really hard that eventually someone is going to come along and shine the spotlight on you and recognize you for your talents and your capabilities and give you -

Sandi MarLisa (04:47):


Angie Colee (04:48):

Give you permission to step up. And I feel like that's almost the impetus behind this podcast. Like you don't actually need permission, hence the irony of the name, but I'm giving you permission in case you're waiting for it. I love that little laugh.

Sandi MarLisa (05:08):

I think we've all sort of been in that space of wishing someone would come and save us and no one's coming, honey. Like if you cannot recognize your own worth and your own value, the world, the world is not going to raise your price. And I can't remember who said that, but that's a really good, that's a really good like thought is you have to know how much you're worth. Like if you walk into a store, right, you're not bargaining for the price. Target sets its own prices. Okay. This is $14.99, that's it? Like you have to set your price. This is what I'm worth, period.

Angie Colee (05:43):

Well, and that's cool. Like the Target thing too, you look at that price $14.99 and you decide whether you want to pay for that or not like there's no, they set the price. You decide what you want to pay. And you either walk out without the thing, if you don't like it, or you add the thing to your card, if you do like it and there you go. And like business and creativity can be that easy too.Well, I don't want to say easy. I want to say simple because that's not necessarily easy. And I want to make that distinction between easy and simple because yeah, nobody's coming along to save you. Just like you said, this ain't the thirties where you get discovered by sitting at a bar.

Sandi MarLisa (06:22):

No, I mean, honestly, and especially with social media, sort of leveling the playing field for average people to be able to do their own creative pursuits and especially not needing anyone to give them permission to do that because you have a platform that reaches billions of people and maybe you won't reach all those billions of people, but like what if you could reach a thousand, like that's perfectly possible in the online world. And so leveling that playing field, it's kind of interesting to see how people are able to take control of their own creative pursuits and not have to wait on anyone to say, "Hey, you're good" necessarily. That's, you know, one of the big wigs, all

Angie Colee (07:04):

Right. I love that shift in the cultural narrative too. And I think that that's where a lot of that kind of head trash, I know that I have as a creative comes from, is that before, when you were creating art, you did have to get approval from someone to get your art out there in a big way, because there were gatekeepers, right? And now the gatekeepers are gone because of social media and the internet and what a time to be alive, especially for creators. You can get out there and creates, oh my God, somebody you'll appreciate this because you're a musician to somebody. I geek out over music. She sent me a video yesterday and it had these like tight complex harmonies. And you know what, I'm just going to go for, it's my podcast. I can say whatever the hell I want.

Sandi MarLisa (07:43):

Do it, do it!

Angie Colee (07:43):

I sent her a text and I was like, "You don't need to know this, but that made my nipples hard. Man. That was good." See musicians, get it. Like you said, you know, you know what I'm talking about?

Sandi MarLisa (07:58):

Orgasmic that is what that is.

Angie Colee (07:58):

That was fantastic. It just that, you know what that was, that was a video on YouTube. That wasn't a big production that had to go on MTV and gets like the top hits and go through all the record deals and stuff like that. This guy set up three microphones next to his piano had, and it was recorded. Live had a guy in there with probably like a steady cam rig, just jumping between the singers and their faces as they sang. And they, they just whipped it out and put it online. Fantastic.

Sandi MarLisa (08:25):

I'm sorry, you said "made my nipples hard." And then you said "whipped it out." It was two completely different.

Angie Colee (08:29):

We're just going there. We're just going there. I'm probably like my last episode that I recorded. Cause I record a couple of different episodes a day. Uh, we were talking about her past experience researching cock rings. So it's, it's probably already like a mindset thing that I'm carrying over.

Sandi MarLisa (08:49):

That's it.

Angie Colee (08:49):

You never know what we're going to talk about on this podcast. Could it be cock rings? Could it be music? You never know. So let's dig into this a little bit more because I know that, especially in the past year, I've seen you just explode onto the scene in a big way and really just embrace all of this creativity and all of this stuff that you have to share. Like I'm just going to throw you into the lion's den there. Tell me about it.

Sandi MarLisa (09:18):

Tell you about it. Um, so my life has been a little bit different than most people who, you know, went through their twenties. I had kids super young, super young, um, was married very young to my high school sweetheart. And, um, recently got a divorce. And um, my ex was, uh, you know, he has, he suffers from, um, some very serious mental illnesses and I was his caregiver for a long time. And, um, it just got to the point where we had to separate and that separation and that realization of, oh my God, I have to separate from this person that I love so much really just sent me on a, in a spiral of self discovery and like, what am I doing? Like, why don't I do music anymore? Like why, why, why, why am, why, why am I like this? Like what happened? You know, and you know, my, my life has not been easy and I realized that in the daily drudgery I lost what made me magical. And, um, I had to do a lot of self work. I went to therapy and just kind of realized I was, I was kicked out of a church in my early twenties. And, uh, music was so spiritual for me that when I got kicked out, I shut that self by that part of myself down. And, um, when I started picking it up and it was very slow, it was, I can't do anything that has any sort of spiritual meaning. First of all, that was not it. Uh, so I started doing 80's synth pop.

Angie Colee (10:57):

Kind of the opposite of church music.

Sandi MarLisa (11:00):

The complete opposite of what I used to do. And as I started doing that and I started getting out in front of people again, it was kind of incredible. Like I lost weight, I became more confident. I dressed differently. I carried myself differently and I just realized like this part of myself was key in my, and in me being passionate in me owning who I am. And, um, it was just kind of funny how that thing I had forgotten about was the very crux of what made me, who I am. And, um, I think that's where it stems from is really just that one part of myself that I let go opened up the door to so many other areas of my life. Like I'm not just confident on the stage. I'm confident now in all areas of my life. And, um, when I talk to new people or, um, like if I'm pitching a client or, you know, even my friendships cutting people off, if I have to, like, that's the kind of thing it sort of led me to, and it sort of blew my mind. I was like, wow, I ha I didn't realize that who I was was so tied up in what I love to do. Um, and yeah, so that's kind of like, I've just been inhabiting that space again and realizing like, "Oh, oh yeah, I'm an artist and an entrepreneur." And honestly, there's not much difference between the two, most of the time, you know, I haven't worked for The Man in a decade and you know, my last real job was fast food when I was 19 and yeah, and I have not been struggling and I always made it work and just being proud of myself for that like, damn, girl, like you did it.

Angie Colee (12:43):

Hell yeah. Celebrate.

Sandi MarLisa (12:46):

You're not starving. You know, you feed your kids doing this. And it's just that like kind of owning where I am in my life and all the work I've put into it. And yeah, I've had a difficult life and I've given everything to the people that I love. And yeah, some shit didn't work out, but I'm damn proud of who I am. And from that space I feel is what people are seeing now is kind of me just owning it. Like I was always doing this work, um, except for music, but I was always doing this work and now it just has that power behind it I think.

Angie Colee (13:23):

Because that creative outlet was missing before, like that part of yourself, that was almost being like denied or repressed. And I want to say a lot of creative people can probably identify with that too. Especially as we're told, you know, that you have responsibilities and you have to get a job and you have to pay for things. I know that growing up, my, my folks meant well, but they totally did not see me being a musician or a writer and being able to support myself. It was all about "You're so smart, go be a doctor or a lawyer." And I was like, "I don't want to wear pantyhose. Panty hose are the devil."

Sandi MarLisa (13:55):

Yeah. It's like that, um, episode. It's that part in "Fantastic Beasts" where Dumbledore, um, looks at, um, Newt Scamander. And he sees like a desk as what, um, his boggart turns into. And he's like, "Why are you afraid of a desk?" And Newt's like, "I'm afraid of working in an office." Like, that's what I'm afraid of. And that's kind of, I think like how I was growing up, I was like, I don't want to do this if this is being an adult. Fuck that.

Angie Colee (14:22):

Yeah. If this is what life is like, fuck that I'm going to do something else.

Sandi MarLisa (14:30):

Count me out. Deuces. And like that was it.

Angie Colee (14:31):

I love that for so many years because I even feel, I know that my mom bought into that narrative for a long time too. Cause she tried a bunch of different business routes. And I interviewed her very early on in the podcast. Um, but recently for the last few years she's been working on baking. Everybody in the damn family knew that that woman was meant to be a, she shows up at all of the family. Like she bakes the stuff for Christmas for, for all the family and stuff like that. But every time one of us floated the idea of like, maybe you could make a living being a baker. It's like, nah, like I gotta, you gotta get a job. You can't beat. You. Can't do this creative thing that you love and support yourself. And Sandi and I are here to say bullshit, bullshit, bullshit. A.

Sandi MarLisa (15:10):


Angie Colee (15:14):

Calling BS on that.

Sandi MarLisa (15:16):

You have to decide what is your priority in life? And um, like what, what is it? Is it a big, fancy house? Is it a big car? Or like, do you literally need to do what your soul loves? And can you trust that if you explore that, if you trust that about yourself, that you're going to be okay. Like, listen, I don't, you know, it's not that like, I'm not looking to be, this is just me. And I know some people are about that, about that money. And it's not that I don't, I'm not about the money. I love money. It's just like, I just, I own a modest house and I love my home. I love my neighborhood. I love my community. I get to gig four nights a week. I get to write, I get to hang out with my friends and have bonfires in a backyard that I own that's success to me. Like my kids are fed, you know? And I've gotten to the point where I'm like, man, if you know, if this really just goes downhill, like my car is pretty nice. Like I can, I can hang out in there for a bit.

Angie Colee (16:14):

Yeah. I bet.

Sandi MarLisa (16:15):

You know, that's just kind of, just becaue I'm doing what makes me happy. That is wealth to me. Like the fact that I can live the life that I live, that is wealth to me

Angie Colee (16:24):

I think that's so important because so many people, you know, to talk about being sold this cultural narrative, they have that very narrow definition of what success is and what being rich means. And I think a lot of people, especially in the entrepreneur space are just mindlessly working toward, you know, I need to hit that number. Once, once I hit that number, everything will be worth it. I had that, I think my first few years as a freelance writer, I was like, once I get to six figures, I'll be fine.

Sandi MarLisa (16:52):


Angie Colee (16:53):

Once I got to

Sandi MarLisa (16:54):

It's understandable, I guess,

Angie Colee (16:56):

And I just wanted to see if I could do it, but once I got to six figures, it was like, okay, I did it. Now what? Okay. Now the goalposts need to change. Then it became dealing with the fear of, can I do this again? Or was I one hit, wonder I did manage to do it again. Um, and then like now going now, I'm in a completely different place where I'm pursuing a different passion, being, being a host, being a coach, being a podcast entrepreneur, what the hell is this? And my income has taken a hit accordingly, but just like you, like, I'm making it work. I'm in this AirBnB that is far from fancy, but it's comfortable. It's private, it's got strong wifi. That's all I really need.

Sandi MarLisa (17:39):

And I don't know, like my definition of failure has just dramatically shifted from what I thought it was and was some stuff that I've done. And some work that I've taken on that I did just to prove that I was intelligent, you know, like, um, for like growing up as an artist. And most of the stuff that I do that I'm really good at is, you know, music or creative writing, like all this stuff. People don't put monetary value on very much growing up in that space because a lot of insecurities for me because I was thinking, well, maybe I'm just not smart, intelligent. And so I kind of had to go and prove my salt in the business world for a while to prove to myself I'm intelligent and I do work hard and I can be business savvy. If I want to, you know, I can be successful in this arena if I want to, but I don't want to

Angie Colee (18:35):

That's such an important thing to point out too, especially to creative people, because what you basically just said is I'm smart and I'm capable and I can learn this skill. And there are so many creative. And like, I really, I think this is going to speak to a lot of entrepreneurs, but I created this podcast specifically for creatives because of this kind of head trash that we're talking about today. And that's exactly what I wanted to tell them, like, this is learnable, this is doable. You can figure this stuff out and then you can figure out just like Sandi did exactly where your line is and what you want to focus on. Whether it's more on the creative side, more on the business side, there's space for everybody here.

Sandi MarLisa (19:11):

Yeah. Learning the business skills has helped me so much in my more creative pursuits. Um, and I think it has given me an edge as far as being a creative cause a lot of creatives that I meet and I love them so much, but they are the most dramatic, the most egotistical, um, up in the clouds people sometimes. And they don't, they've never learned how to have their feet on the ground. And um, because of that, they think that every challenge that they're met with is like the end of the world. And instead of a problem that is perfectly capable of being solved. And so I think being in that space and learning the business skills has really empowered me to be a better creative. Like it's not my number one favorite aspect of it, but I don't, you know, lay down and die. When I met with a, you know, a challenge that has to do with, uh, you know, um, being booked or working with difficult people or, you know, getting into a new venue or, you know, having those business calls. Um, and you know, I think that is something I think most creatives would benefit from because being in this space, um, you know, most people don't start out with a manager or a booker. Like you have to handle that stuff on your own. You have to have those business conversations with bar owners. Like, why should I hire you? Why should I pay you this price when I'm paying this other dude, this price? Well, because I'm better or, you know, or well, because I bring in more people or, you know, giving those reasons. Um, so anyway, I think it all ties in together. Uh, if you're patient enough to learn those skills like you were talking about.

Angie Colee (21:02):

Absolutely. And I'm glad that you said that too, because I think the difference between the dramatic creatives and like you and I are creatives too, we're perfectly rational, but very passionate people.

Sandi MarLisa (21:13):

Um, yeah.

Angie Colee (21:14):

And I, I'm so glad that you said that, like it's a problem to be solved. It's not the end of the world because Hey guys, uh, bad news, I'm gonna to rain on your parade here. Uh, you're going to have to solve problems every day for the rest of your damn life until the day you die, you will have problems to solve. Um, there is no magical finish line into happy lands where once you've done all of the hard work and you have achieved all the things it's smooth sailing from here. Uh, the good news is that if you're smart about the problems that you tackle now, especially like turning your art into a business, uh, you can create better problems that are less terrifying. You know, like your problem becomes, oh, do I need to hire someone versus, oh, do I have to live in my car? It's different problems,

Sandi MarLisa (22:01):

Exactly. Different problems, different levels of problems.

Angie Colee (22:04):

There's still problems. And that ties into, I think another fear that I've heard a lot of creative say, which is that if I turn this into a business, I don't think I'm going to love it anymore. So they always have this starving artist. I can't make money off this. This has to be my hobby or I won't love it kind of thing. And I don't know about you, but when I started writing for a living and getting paid for it, I loved it even more. Woohoo.

Sandi MarLisa (22:25):

Yeah. I'm getting freaking paid for this. And I think as well, um, well this kind of goes into the, not having to decide a niche thing. Um, I, I believe because I'm, I'm kind of like that too. As soon as I like give myself a target, I'm afraid I'm going to get bored because I am someone who likes to wake up and let the day come to me. Like I'm a, a stream of consciousness writer. So when I sit down, um, I don't know what I'm going to write about. I just write about whatever and it comes out the way that it comes out. And so there is that fear to me about putting up those barriers around your creativity. But what I have found is probably the only full foolproof system. If you are like that, if you have that mentality is to invest in your community, invest in your people, because then they'll love every single thing that you do. And you don't have to pinpoint yourself or, you know, corner yourself into anything. Like I went from just writing essays on Facebook and people loved what I wrote and they loved my book and I'm not talking about millions of people here, guys, I'm talking about, you know, 5,000 people that I interact with and on online. But I made that shift to music. And now they're showing up to my shows, the same people who were reading my stuff are showing up to my shows. Not because you know, were focused on one specific thing that I produced, but because they love me, they love me. And that's something we don't really talk about a lot is, you know, another kind of wealth is social capital. If you invest in your people, if you show them, you know, kindness, if you improve their lives, in some respect, they will become loyal to you. Not to what you produce necessarily. They'll love what you produce, but whatever you want to do, wherever you go, they'll follow you. Um, I think that's important as a creative is, um, so many people get so bogged down in the work that they forget about the people that are paying or, you know, desiring to consume their creation. Yeah.

Angie Colee (24:29):

Yeah. And people that respect it because they don't know how to do it too. Like they want you as part of their life because they want that art in that music. And they don't know how to do it themselves. And maybe, maybe even they're too scared to try. So to bring it back around, to giving them permission, to even try just by doing you and being you. And I'm so glad you mentioned that because that kind of circles back to what you said, which is also smart about being able to go to a musical gig and say why me versus just, you know, creating for creation sake and then hoping someone spotlights you and says, this is why this person is great. Like sometimes, actually a lot of times, especially in business, you have to be able to shine this mirror on yourself. And a lot of times when we look in this mirror, it's very warped. It's very, you're a piece of shit. Here's the reasons why you suck compared to all these other people. Like it's a distorted mirror when you're looking at yourself. And so that's why I think you have to just, like you said, surround yourself with people, get out there, interact, put your work out there, be you. And then that way they can help you look into a more loving mirror. One that reflects more of the truth back at you, of who you are.

Sandi MarLisa (25:34):

Listen to what they're saying about you. Believe them.

Angie Colee (25:40):

Yes. That's why this podcast exists. That's actually a funny story too, because I was on stage at a couple of events. When I ran the team for this big marketing guru and he had me breaking down copy and writing sales materials live on stage and people were coming back to the back of the room. When I got off stage and telling me, somebody comes up to me one day and he says, "You have a great voice. You should have a podcast." And I was like, "what the hell are you smoking? My voice is all wrong. And like, I hear these other people, like, no." He said, "oh, well thank you for the information. I appreciate it. Have a nice day." Then it happened again. Then it happened again. And suddenly my brain went, these people don't know each other and they can't. They have nothing to gain from telling me this. There's no, there's nothing in it for them to come and say, you should have a podcast. I would listen to you on a podcast. So that was when it really kind of the switch flipped for me because I recognize there's, there's all these independent people telling me that they want this thing from me. Who am I to tell them, no, you're wrong. I'm not going to do this. Yeah. Yeah.

Sandi MarLisa (26:46):

I love that. I think people, most, most people are good. Most people are not there to tear you down. Most people are not lying to you. Like if someone is coming up to you and like you said, and you're getting this repeated message, they're seeing something you can't see because you're too close. You're too close to yourself. You can't see these other facets of you that other people do. And like you said, like if you listen to them, sometimes these doors splitting wide open and you had no idea you even wanted this door, but because you trusted what other people were saying, because you allowed collaboration into your life. Like, oh, this is the breakthrough that I was looking for. I just needed to listen.

Angie Colee (27:26):


Sandi MarLisa (27:28):

Imagine that.

Angie Colee (27:30):

And then like the funny thing was starting at two is I had all these fears of, you know, I'm not going to get five guests and then I got five guests. I, I don't, I don't know if I'm going to get 10. Then when I got 10 and suddenly in three months, I literally filled up the entire year with guests, people that want to come on the show and it's, it's made it easy because I've just leaned into that thing that people told me they like about me, the ability to just have a conversation and riff like this with people. Uh, I like to think of myself as someone that can make somebody else look like a total rockstar. I really try to make all of my guests feel super comfortable and super like own into their expertise, share what they know. Uh, and as a result, I've had some interesting conversations with people that say they want to be guests until they find out what the format of my show is, which is, tell me what you think you want to talk about. Okay, we'll get on sound check right before we start recording and we'll start there and we'll, we'll probably wind up somewhere completely different. I don't have any questions for you. I don't have any prep materials for you. This is going to be a hundred percent show up and wing this thing. And some people are super, super uncomfortable with that. I'm discovering. And I've had a couple of episodes where people like they definitely came on to teach something and I would try and steer them more toward like, tell me about your business. Tell me about your fears and your experience. Like, let's talk about this. And they would go back to the teaching point. And I was like, okay, it's still going to be a really good episode because again, I want them to look and feel like a rock star, but it's cool doing this as almost an experiment for me and figuring out what my art as a podcast host looks like.

Angie Colee (29:05):

And the people that get it, like previous guests, I still don't know how we wound up on cock rings. Um, that was the thing that popped up. And you and I just talking about like all of these different pieces of art and component and how it interacts with and weaves throughout your life, I think is fascinating. I love just having these conversations, let alone, getting to record and share them with people. It's amazing. Um, yeah. So I was glad when you said that you're a stream of conscious writer, cause I'm definitely a stream of conscious podcaster. Oh there's a shiny thought let's follow that for a while.

Sandi MarLisa (29:42):

My band mate, gosh, it drives him absolutely up the wall. I'm a person that doesn't like to do this the same song the same way twice. It gets boring, man, like so boring. Like I want to try different riffs. I want to sing this chorus three times instead of two, but he's so good. He works with me. Like he knows like just eye contact, like where I'm going. Um, and that's just kind of proof, like you have to own who you are as a person because the right people that need to work with you and need to be in your life, they're going to get it.

Angie Colee (30:14):


Sandi MarLisa (30:14):

They just are.

Angie Colee (30:16):

They really are. I don't mean, you know, to double on that or to pile on that, I guess. I don't know. I dunno where I'm going with that, but I had a blues band for several years and I loved it for that same reason because we had to hand signals and you know, we're musicians. So, you know, there's a way that you talk to the band when you're on stage, watch for it next time. If you're at a show, you'll see them kind of talking to each other. Um, and so I would signal like I want to do another verse. Nope. You're soloing, you're soloing, you're soloing. And we'll just have five solos back to back. I'm going to point at you and it's your turn to go. And I had so much fun with that. And then I auditioned for another band. Cause I wanted to change, got a little bored. Who knew? Creatives! You'll appreciate this. I auditioned for an eighties, hair metal, glam bands.

Sandi MarLisa (30:58):

Oh, that is so specific. I love it.

Angie Colee (31:00):

I know. It was fantastic. And I got the gig and there, I got the gig. We're at practice one day, we're jamming out. We're having, I think it was like Van Halen's Panama or something like that. Having a hell of a time. And the guitarist stops and he looks at me and he goes, "Angie, I think that riff goes like," like he corrected me. And I was like, "um, I'm not David Lee Roth." He's just like, newsflash. Look at my chest. I'm clear. I don't have the right equipment to be at David Lee Roth. And he's like, "well, people come to our shows to hear their favorite songs. Like their favorite bands play them." And I was like, "people listen to records to hear their favorite bands play the songs the way they do. People come to shows because they just want to enjoy the music. And I don't think any single person is going to come to our show and expect Angie to sound like David Lee Roth."

Sandi MarLisa (31:47):


Angie Colee (31:47):

I'm not him. And so we actually wound up parting ways because of it. Cause I was like, I am not going to do this note perfect. I'm not here to be your note perfect person. Like I want this to be fun and engaging. And if we decide to do the same verse four times in a row, because the crowd's really feeling it. Hell yeah!

Sandi MarLisa (32:04):

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Angie Colee (32:06):

Hell yeah.

Sandi MarLisa (32:08):

I love that. I mean, that's exactly how it's just like cover bands. You know, I I've talked to a few people in there and one of the biggest struggles of being somebody that plays covers is some people literally, because they've heard the song, you know, all their life or, you know, it's such a well known song. They don't know how to deviate from the original, like that's a struggle. Like they just don't know how. And so for me, like I legitimately, I don't really listen to music that much. I know that shocks people constantly, but I really I'm a very quiet brain person. I like the music that I write. That's just how I am. But um, so whenever I had to come up with 40 songs, you know, in a two and a half weeks, uh, for my first show with my acoustic act and I like to do cover songs, listening to them two times and then I wait it out and then it comes out the way it comes out. Because if you listen to it so much to the point where you're trying to get it perfect. You're never going to be able to deviate from that. And I think like creativity kind of works that way a lot is. This is a random tangent, but this is something I truly believe as a creative. I think sometimes creatives consume so much content that it infects the purity of their own creativity.

Angie Colee (33:32):


Sandi MarLisa (33:33):

Like you start sounding like everybody else. And that's something I try to explain to my, um, um, I say coworkers, but other people who aren't musicians, like I don't listen to other music too much because, um, I'm a creator. My job in this world in my opinion, is to create and other people are the ones who do most of the consuming. And that is not me. My job is to create the work and that's what I enjoy doing. And um, in order for me to do that authentically and its most purest form, I don't consume a ton. Um, and I think people, Gary V talks about this all the time. He's like, I want to get you guys to a point where you're not reading my stuff anymore.

Angie Colee (34:24):

Hmm. Interesting.

Sandi MarLisa (34:26):

I want to get you to a point where you're doing the work and not listening to my inspirational messages. Therapists tell you that. I'm trying to work myself out of the job. Yeah. It is kind of, and that's kind of where I approach that space is like, I know my role, my role is to create, um, anyway, that was a tangent, but that's why I'm super passionate about it actually

Angie Colee (34:48):

That's totally, it's totally applicable. And I'll tell you why. Because like with, with the coaching that I do with people that are starting to do create a businesses, they want to start their own creative business, just like this. They want to freelance or they want to create products, whatever it is. Um, and that still applies because like, as a coach, when I'm working with these entrepreneurs, I don't want them to hang around forever, depending on me. I don't want to make their decisions for them. I want to teach them how to trust their own intuition, follow their own signals trust in that own, their own inner authority. Talk about confidence, right? If you're depending on someone else to inform you, what's good, what's bad. You don't have any kind of internal compass that you can follow. Whereas if you are putting yourself out there, try new things, creating things, making mistakes, learning as you go, that inner authority goes, okay. Yeah. This direction feels based on stuff we've done in the past. I'm reasonably sure we can figure this out. And I think that's just, that's fantastic. I think that I don't think was a tanget at all.

Angie Colee (35:52):

No, I think that's amazing. And so I, I have loved every minute of this. I can talk with you about music all day. I will send you that song that I mentioned earlier in the episode.

Sandi MarLisa (36:05):

Please do.

Angie Colee (36:05):

You can geek out over it with me. Sandi, tell us a little bit more about where to find you online.

Sandi MarLisa (36:10):

Uh, you can find me at Um, Sandi with an "i". Um, my site is down for maintenance right now, but it's going to look really cool when it's up. Uh, you can also purchase my book on Amazon. "To All Who Wander," um, just type that in and it'll pop up and it's pretty good. I think you'll enjoy it.

Angie Colee (36:32):

If guys, if, if just the essays that I see you post on Facebook are any indication I haven't bought the book, but I'm going to remedy that as soon as we finish recording.

Sandi MarLisa (36:39):


Angie Colee (36:42):

I promise you are going to love these essays. You're going to get something really. And if you're even the slightest bit creative, you're going to find some serious inspiration in those pages. So thank you so much for being on the show. I'm going to make sure that they have clickable links in the show notes. And we're going to do this again for sure.

Sandi MarLisa (36:58):

Thank you Angie. I had fun. This is fine.

Angie Colee (37:03):

So that is it. Another awesome episode of Permission to Kick Ass on the books. If you want to know more about the show or if you want to know more about me, Angie Colee and the mission I'm on to help entrepreneurs punch fear in the face and do big bold things, then head on over to That is all one word together, Make sure to sign up for my email list so that you know whenever there's a hot, fresh and ready podcast episode out for you. And also on Mondays, I like to send out a little newsletter called Kick Monday's Ass. I'm sure you're totally, totally surprised by that. So thank you for being here with me today. I'm Angie Colee. Make sure that you share this with a friend that needs to hear this message today. Like it, share it. Comment wherever you're listening to this today and let's go kick some ass.